Pub Theology

Book Buzz

Or was that the delicious IPA I had before dinner? » The book is out, people are buying it, and apparently some are even reading it!

I’ve heard from readers spread out as disparately as Portland, OR and Washington DC, as well as Turkey and Guatemala.

So far only positive feedback, but some crabby, negative reviews are sure to come. That will have to be a separate post!

Here’s a taste of the great feedback coming in from readers of Pub Theology:


“I started reading your book and I can’t put it down! So refreshing! I wish I lived closer so that I could come to the pub theology meetings!”


“Finished the book. LOVED IT! Bryan, your view of the world and how it can be is refreshing!”


“Just bought mine on Kindle. I can hardly wait to read it. Your help in getting us started with our Theology Pub in Alamosa CO was very much appreciated. It’s going great. We have a good mix of Christians, atheists, agnostics, Buddhists, Universalists and undecided’s coming.”


“Very interested in your book. I’m doing some in-depth research into our pub discussion scene here in Portland where there is even a church meeting in a pub. Ordered one yesterday. Eagerly awaiting delivery.”



“Congrats on the new book! As an indie bookseller I’m really excited to see this is out.”


“[My son] gave me your book because I am kind of a pub theologian but with Jack Daniels. My brother and I preach to a Church that meets in our old airplane hanger and is full of broken people, including the Preachers. We make our living in the lumber business but along the way met old radicals like Will Campbell and others. Your book has some great stuff in it, good luck in DC.”


“Hi Bryan, just started your book, Pub Theology. I am a graduate of Hope College and currently serving  with my wife in Guatemala.

I stumbled across your book on Amazon by “accident”. I was searching for books on breweries to give me a foundation for my love of beer. The Guatemalan beer is just awful and a recent dream of mine has been start my own microbrewery in Guatemala (in addition to our ministry).

I have been struggling on how to combine my passion for beer with my biggest passion: Jesus. I am just embarking on this process of prayer and excited to gain your insight about finding a genuine faith at the table of conversation. I hope to gain insight and apply it not only to my life, but to our mission in Guatemala.

I have never been much of a reader, but I haven’t been able to put down your book. Can’t wait to finish it and hopefully discuss some of it with you! Thank you.”

And there are a couple reviews up on Amazon:

Moving the Church Forward July 9, 2012
By Ca
Format:Kindle Edition|Amazon Verified Purchase

Three things that I love: beer, conversation, and God. For those that love all three of those things…or even just two of those things…or even just one…this book is for you. Berghoef writes honestly and candidly. He crafts stories that are humorous, engaging, and challenging. Like Berghoef, I grew up in the traditional church and was severely discontent with how the church forbid conversations about other faiths (and said you couldn’t drink beer). It will challenge readers to enter into a nonjudgemental conversation with others, where it is not necessary for you, as a Christian, to have all of the answers…in fact, you shouldn’t. There is a contagious excitement in this book and it does not let go of you from beginning to end.
Including a review from one of our own pub theologians!
Format:Kindle Edition|Amazon Verified Purchase

(Full disclosure: I’m a regular attendee of the author’s Pub Theology gatherings, so you may want to take this review with a grain of salt. On the other hand, I can vouch for the accuracy and honesty of his account, so there’s that.)

“Pub Theology” makes me hopeful. It’s about sitting down with people and talking about ideas, and that’s something that few people bother to do any more. Even fewer bother to talk about ideas with people who disagree with them. In “Pub Theology” Bryan Berghoef has provided a pattern for starting (and continuing!) conversations with those who disagree with us – conversations which can move beyond argument or debate and into the realm of communication and actual understanding.

Pub Theology – the practice, and the book – is mostly about talking. Not always talking about God, but always talking within a community that respects and appreciates itself and each member. Talking in this way is a skill, and it doesn’t always come naturally. Some people have a hard time expressing their thoughts in a group, and some people have a hard time listening. But as with other skills, it’s something you can acquire. The ability to understand others and to make oneself understood even when you disagree about your fundamental values and presuppositions is a wonderful thing to have. Through the anecdotes and insights in this book, Berghoef explains how to create an nurture a community that fosters these skills in its members, and shares some ways that community has shaped his faith and ministry for the better.

I can imagine this book being frightening to some; Berghoef touches on ways in which religious traditions can make the possibility of communication with those outside the tradition seem dangerous. But even if – especially if – you are one who holds to a beloved creed or catechism, I would recommend reading and reflecting on this book. Berghoef is far from an iconoclast; he comes from a strong Dutch Reformed tradition and understands the power and importance of tradition in religion. Nevertheless, he has found that interacting with those of other faiths and of no faith has made his own faith stronger and more robust, and in “Pub Theology” he invites us all to join him. Try a sip!

If you haven’t checked out the book, pick up a copy! Don’t forget our book launch is tomorrow at Brew!

Otherwise you can pick one up online.
Paperback
Kindle

I am looking for more Amazon.com reviews, as well as a blog review or two!

Would love to hear what you think, and most importantly, for you to get involved in some good conversations wherever you are.

Book Launch!

Book Launch!

This Thursday we are going to have the official book launch for Pub Theology! (RSVP on Facebook)

Join us from 6-8pm at Brew, downtown Traverse City, 108 E. Front St.

Pick up your copy of the book,  hang out with some pub theologians, and, of course, enjoy a well-crafted beer!

Should be fun!  Bring a friend.  Stick around after for one of our regular Pub Theology discussions.

Can’t make it out?

You can order your copy here:
Paperback
Kindle

Already read the book?  Looking for reviews on Amazon.com.

Pub Theology Topics, July 5 2012

The book, the beer, the sheet

On a busy night in Traverse City, fresh off the Fourth of July and on the eve of the Cherry Festival, a few of us found our way to a pub for some reasonable conversation.  It was good to be back at Pub Theology tonight after a couple week hiatus.  The Saugatuck IPA was a welcome addition to the menu, and we had a good evening of discussion.

The topics:

1.    If you were stranded on a desert island and could only have one item, what would it be?

2.    Are all spiritual experiences legitimate?

3.    What is happiness?

4.    “The very meaningfulness of rational discourse depends on God, as everything depends on God.”

5.    If our world belongs to God, is the idea of private property a contradiction of this?

6.    Man exists in a state of distance from the world that he nonetheless remains in the midst of.
Can the distance be overcome?

7. What really matters?

We shared some experiences and perspectives, some sips and some tips.

Great stuff.

We also celebrated the arrival of Pub Theology, the book!  You can buy your copy locally at Brew, and soon at Horizon Books – both downtown.  You can join us at the Book Launch next week Thursday, July 12 at Brew, from 6-8pm, preceding our normal Pub Theology conversation.

In the meantime, share your thoughts on the above topics!

Wild Goose Recap!

So, the family loaded in the van last week and headed for the hills (literally!) of North Carolina to attend the Wild Goose Festival.

What is the Wild Goose Festival?  New friend Milton described it this way:

“The festival [titled after a metaphor for Celtic Christianity] is self-described as one of spirituality, justice, music, and art. People came and camped in the woods and sang and talked and ate and looked for ways to connect. To me it felt like a cross between Woodstock and church youth camp. When I looked out over the field of participants, in most any direction I saw people who didn’t look like “church folks” who were lost in wonder, love, and grace. For these four days, they got to feel understood. “Normal.” None of us was asked to do more than be ourselves and welcome one another.

And it was good.”

Someone else called it: “A Sacred and Safe Space.”  I agree.  We arrived in Shakori Hills with a loaded up van, drove down a dusty road under a home-made banner with a  painted bird figure and the lettering for ‘Wild Goose’.

The welcome booth was a wooden shack with scenes from Where the Wild Things Are painted on it.

We set up our tent right in the center of activity – between a smaller tent venue labeled ‘Return’, and the main stage for the festival.  The theme of the festival was “Exile and Return”, so speaking/music event venues were named accordingly:  Shadow, Exile, Return, and so on.

We didn’t know what to expect, other than that we loved the concept, and were excited about some of the speakers and musicians slated to be there.

Let me tell you, this was a festival!

From the first talk we attended on Thursday afternoon — Tom Sine on co-living, intentional communities, and sustainability: “It is essential that we help people reimagine new ways to live. We need to discover creative, celebrative, simple ways of life that are more imaginative than the American Dream and cost less money.  And we need to do it together, in community” — to the final song by Gungor, “God makes beautiful things, he makes beautiful things out of dust.  God makes beautiful things, he makes beautiful things out of us,” we had an incredible time.  It was a time to imagine again what God longs for us and our world.

We met people from Pittsburgh, San Francisco, New York, Texas, Atlanta, Illinois, DC, and all over the country who are hungry for a new form of faith.

We heard Phyllis Tickle review the history of the church from Constantine and the fateful Edict of Milan to today, and the impact of the birth control pill on the future of the faith.  She noted that it is time to “return to the tent” — in other words, the place of the family and the home, where the stories of faith are told, shared, and lived out before the children and the next generation.  We heard Jim Wallis remind us that in the Capital power is the means and power is the ends, but that God’s way is powerlessness.  We heard Brian McLaren encourage us to engage those of other faiths while holding to our own with integrity (Pub Theology, anyone?).  We heard Dave Andrews, a community organizer from Australia encourage us to seek centered-set communities rather than closed-set communities.  He noted: “When we don’t trust the Spirit’s presence and leading, we create [unwittingly] all kinds of programs and plans and so on that actually become manipulative and oppressive.”  He reminded us that wherever we are going to serve and work we have to remember that God is already there — in that people we meet already are imbued with the image of God, and the Spirit is there ahead of us.  He also reminded that it is not so much we who bring Jesus, but that in fact, as we serve, we find that we are serving Jesus himself.

We heard great music from local artists as well as Over the Rhine, David Crowder, Gungor, Vince Anderson — Joey and the boys danced and played as the music filtered over us.

We wandered around and got to chat with Pete Rollins, Mark Scandrette, Phyllis Tickle, Lisa Sharon-Harper from Sojourners.  Had coffee with Brian McLaren and we mused together about our new adventure in Washington DC.  It really was as Frank Schaeffer noted in his own recap, Wild Goose Our Answer to Hate, in the Huffington Post:

“The names of the speakers  added up to a “draw” along with the big name musical performers. But the heart of the festival wasn’t in the events but in the conversations.

For me the highlight of the festival was the fact that there was no wall of separation between us speakers and performers and everyone there. I spent 4 days talking with lots of people from all over America and other places too, about ideas but also about very personal subjects. I met Ramona who was the cook at the Indian food stand and found she is ill and has no health insurance and I was able to connect her with a friend who knew a friend at the WG fest locally to help her get the full checkup she needs. I could do that because the festival was full of the sort of people who help, love and care so for once there was someone to call.”

The list of great things we experienced is hard for me to completely recall, there were so many things:

» Watched the first public reading of Pete Rollins’ new play before it shows in New York.

Drinking beer and discussing theology » Wild Goose Beer Tent

» Met a guy named Michael Camp, who just wrote a book about how his own faith and life was shaped by conversations at the pub: Confessions of a Bible Thumper: My Homebrewed Quest for a Reasoned Faith.  He was interested to hear about my own book on Pub Theology.

» Talked with Milton, a local UCC pastor who is teaching people about the importance of meal and eating together, and how all breaking of bread in some way embodies and reflects the meal we gather around as sacrament.

» Celebrated with friend Phil Snider, fellow Wipf and Stock author, over the publishing of our new books.  By the way, check his out: Preaching After God: Derrida, Caputo, and the Language of Postmodern Homiletics.

» Reconnected with friends met at the Church Planters Academy in Minneapolis: Mike Stavlund, Steve Knight, Susan Phillips, Victoria from Solomon’s Porch, and Rich McCullen, among others.

Was it all perfect?  No.  It was hot!  There were ticks.  There were a couple of long nights getting the kids to bed.  Some sessions didn’t connect like I had hoped.  But in all, it did not disappoint.

Those concerns were minor as we heartily sang hymns while sipping pints of local microbrew during a “Beer and Hymns” session, voices rising with verve (out of tune) with the accompaniment of a tattooed keyboardist.

I met Sean, the owner of Fullsteam Brewery in Durham, NC, after a session entitled: “The Theology of Beer,” which noted the importance of creation, place and celebration in a community, and how a good brewery can be at the heart of community life.  I shared our own experiences at Right Brain and he thought that was pretty cool.

The kids attended sessions where they made play-doh, created crafts, played games, and learned fun new songs: “I’m being eaten by a boa constrictor—and I don’t like it very much!”

We fell asleep each night, with our tent a stone’s throw from the main stage, to late night concerts and the sounds of celebration and conversation, music and singing.

In all, it was a total blast, and we imagined—as we joined the parade the final day, singing with faces painted, “When the Saints Go Marching In”—that when the Kingdom comes in its fullness, we’ve already had a taste.

Pub Theology Book Endorsements

More endorsements on my upcoming book, Pub Theology, in addition to those on the back cover.

“Some of the best theological conversations happen over a beer at the pub. Bryan Berghoef captures something of the relaxed and relational dynamic that makes these discussions so pleasurable, while at the same time wrestling with serious theological questions. So pull up a chair, order your favorite drink, and settle in with this delightful and stimulating book. Invite a friend as well—the conversation’s just getting started.”

—John R. Franke, author of Manifold Witness: The Plurality of Truth

“This is a book about God’s freedom and ours! Bryan Berghoef invites us to pull up a chair and dares us to converse about what matters. No fear! This engrossing and transformative story about how to live an open Christian life will save, stir, and strengthen the faith of many.”

—Samir Selmanovic, author of It’s Really All About God: How Islam, Atheism, and Judaism Made Me a Better Christian

And from the back cover:

Pub Theology is a wonderful, whimsical, and wise story about what happens when a pastor with more questions than answers goes to the pub instead of church.”

—John Suk, author of Not Sure: A Pastor’s Journey from Faith to Doubt and former editor of The Banner

“Bryan Berghoef has given us the most complete presentation to date of what pub theology is, why it exists, and what it contributes to the lives and faiths of an increasing number of Christians. With his conversationally written and accessible reportage, he has also created something close to a manual for those who want to initiate a pub theology circle or simply find and join one.”

—Phyllis Tickle, author of The Great Emergence: How Christianity Is Changing and Why 

Just found out the price will be $18 paperback and $9.99 Kindle version.  Should be available for order in either version by the end of the week at latest (UPDATE: It’s up! Order today!).  (There will be a discount on the paperback if you order directly from the publisher).

Will have a flyer available to show around at the Wild Goose Festival this weekend as well.

Order one today for yourself, and maybe one for a friend!

Pub Theology Topics April 19

A nice, low-key evening at the pub last night.  In the cask was the Aztec Gold, a porter with chocolate, cinnamon, vanilla, and chipotle…  a spicy delicious combination.

We had some good conversations on the topics below:

1.    If the church is to have a future it must:
___________________________________.

2.    Without proper structures life will never grow.  Faith, naturally intuitive, cannot grow without a proper use of logic (structure).  Where there are lapses of faith, there are broken structures of logic.  Faith stretches our logic, and logic should create a space to experience our faith.

3.    “I relax and enjoy life.  I know that whatever I need to know is revealed to me in the perfect time and space sequence.”

4.    This offends me: _________________________.

5.  Humanism or atheism is a wonderful philosophy of life as long as you are big, strong, and between the ages of eighteen and thirty-five. But watch out if you are in a lifeboat and there are others who are younger, bigger, or smarter.

The first topic was in light of Andrew Sullivan’s recent article in Newsweek about the crisis in Christianity.

What do you think?  Is the church in trouble?  What must it do going forward?

I have to say that I highly enjoyed a couple of response pieces:

Diana Butler Bass:  A Resurrected Christianity?

and

Scott Paeth:  The Power of the Powerless

Thanks to Tony Jones for pointing out those responses.  He has more on his blog:  Theoblogy:  What Crisis in Christianity?!?

Pub Theology Topics April 12

A good group at the ol’ pub last night.  The Firestarter Chipotle Porter was quite enjoyable, as was the conversation…  Did you miss it?

Here were the topics:  (it was a full sheet!)

1.    What is your favorite day of the week?

2.    How do you nourish yourself spiritually?
What is a spiritual experience?

3.    What does the church look like at its best?
At its worst?

4.    “There is a time when it is right to explore many religions.  One often has to do this in order to find what grasps one at a level deep enough to permit at least initial commitments to be made.  But those who stay merely students of religion into middle age become dreary.  They know facts and doctrines, and laws and rites, but they know nothing of Mystery.”  Thoughts?

5.    Is there a difference between respect for a person and respect for his/her ideas?
Are we what we stand for?

6.  Resurrection:  literal, mythical, mystical?

7. Should everyone be allowed to ‘stand their ground’ ?
Is the right to bear arms a ‘God-given’ right?

8. Does the separation of church and state mean churches should be silent on issues of justice?

9. What role does the state have in determining whether or not people have healthcare?

10.  “we allow ourselves to believe in a sovereign god not because we really believe in a sovereign god, but because (much like western politics) we need to somehow justify our need to be power-dominating people who quite literally ‘lord’ ourselves over other people…”   Anyone agree?

11. Some religions emphasize the endless cycles of history (Hinduism) where an individual seeks to eventually merge into oneness with universe.   The Christian religion is linear, envisioning a culmination in the return of Christ – an escape from the cycles of history.   Is our culture inclined toward the linear model for some reason or is it just chance that we are a predominantly Christian society?

– – –
Love to hear some thoughts on any of the above.  Post below! 

No Interpretation Needed? Part 2

Last post we asked if it is possible to just read the Bible and understand what it says without having to ‘interpret’ it.

It’s a nice-sounding option, in theory.  Unfortunately for us, that option doesn’t exist.  In fact:

Is not every devotional reading (silent), every sermon (spoken), and every commentary (written) an interpretation or a series of interpretations of a biblical text?

We cannot escape interpreting the Bible.  We are not God.  Therefore, we are relative (conditioned by factors that are neither universal nor unchanging).

The entire history of Christian thought shows that Christians in different times and places have interpreted and understood the Bible differently.

Even at any given time and place, such as our own, is there not always a “conflict of interpretations” between, among, and within various denominational and nondenominational traditions?

approaching the text

If it were as simple as reading it and understanding it, there would be less divergence within Christianity.  But the reality is that there are manifold ways of understanding the text, just as there is no end to the number of denominations and traditions within Christianity.  This does not mean anything goes, or that all interpretations are valid – but merely that the text is rich, deep, textured, and from another time and place, meaning we should never become too strident nor certain that we have ‘the’ interpretation or have it all figured out.

We might be tempted to think that at one point — earlier in history, like in the early church — it was clear and everyone understood it the same.  James K.A. Smith reminds us this was not the case:

For Christians, many of the anxieties of hermeneutics (the theory and process of interpretation) are nothing new.  Well before we were haunted by the specters of Derrida and Foucault, the Christian community grappled with the conflict of interpretations (to say nothing of the Jewish/rabbinical precedents).  One can see such conflicts embedded in the New Testament narrative itself.  In Acts 15, for instance, we see a conflict of interpretations of “the law” — and we see a community grappling with interpretive difference in its midst.  Despite a common mythology, the early church was not a hermeneutic paradise; rather, debates about what counts as the tradition have been integral to the Christian tradition.  The early church was not a golden age of interpretive uniformity; rather, the catholic councils and creeds are the artifacts of a community facing up to the conflict of interpretations.

But often enough, as we noted last time, people simply deny that interpretation is necessary and unavoidable:

“We encounter this general attitude when we offer a viewpoint about, say, some controversial moral or political question to someone who (1) doesn’t like it and (2) doesn’t know how to refute it (perhaps deep down knowing that it is all too much on target) and so replies, “That’s just your opinion.””

Similarly, an unwelcome interpretation of some biblical text may be greeted by the response, “Well, that might be your interpretation, but my Bible clearly says…” In other words, “You interpret; I just see what is plainly there.”

This, however, is simply not the case.  We all interpret.  It is impossible to do otherwise.  We read words or speak words, they combine to form meanings, and we interpret what that meaning is.

This “no interpretation needed” doctrine says that interpretation is accidental and unfortunate, that it can and should be avoided whenever possible.  Often unnoticed is that this theory is itself an interpretation of interpretation and that it belongs to a long-standing philosophical tradition that stretches from certain strands in Plato’s thought well into the twentieth century.  This tradition is called “naive realism” in one of its forms.  It is called naive both descriptively, because it is easily taken by a common-sense perspective without philosophical reflection, and normatively, because it is taken to be indefensible on careful philosophical reflection.  (Westphal, Whose Community?  Which Interpretation?)

So is there no one ‘right’ interpretation?  Well… there is the original intention of the author, and then the original intent of the Holy Spirit… and certainly we must hold that God knows what he meant (means) to say.  But the point holds: we are not God.  Therefore, there is always a distance between us and that truest understanding of the text.  This is where faith and community comes in, and Merold Westphal, in his terrific book, Whose Community?  Which Interpretation?, sounds this note exactly:

We need not think that hermeneutical despair (“anything goes”) and hermeneutical arrogance (we have “the” interpretation) are the only alternatives.  We can acknowledge that we see and interpret “in a glass darkly” or “in a mirror, dimly” and that we know “only in part” (1 Cor. 13:12), while ever seeking to understand and interpret better by combining the tools of scholarship with the virtues of humbly listening to the interpretations of others and above all, to the Holy Spirit.

My friend Chris put it in very nearly the same way, in response to my first post:

Reading the Bible doesn’t require any special study; understanding it is another matter.

Anyone can “get something” out of just reading the Bible (or any other piece of literature). But if we’re concerned to do our best to “get” what the author(s) intended, then we have a lot of work ahead of us, especially dealing with a collection of ancient books written in ancient languages from ancient and diverse cultures with ancient and diverse systems of law, morality, and religion. If that work is beyond us, then we at least have the work of learning from the experts.

 

So should you read the Bible on your own, in light of all this?  Yes!  Of course.  God will speak.  Just be sure you check with your friends (and maybe a good commentary) before you say, “God told me…”

No Interpretation Needed?

Are you skeptical about biblical interpretation?  Does it seem that someone can just “make it say anything?”  Are you one of those who would prefer to just “read it for what it says”?

 

You’re not alone.  Many are intimidated by the vast amount of study some seem to think reading the Bible requires.  Can’t I just take the “plain sense” of a text and arrive at what God is trying to say to me?

 

See? It clearly says right here...

When someone encounters an interpretation of the Bible she doesn’t like, she may respond with, “Well that’s just your interpretation.  My Bible says this instead…”

 

After all, much easier to dismiss someone’s interpretation (which involves a bit of their own thinking), than to actually dismiss a passage of the Bible itself.  So perhaps we are better off trying to rest on the “Bible” instead of an “interpretation.”

 

 

As Merold Westphal puts it:

 

“Common sense . . .  claims to “just see” its objects, free of bias, prejudice, and presuppositions (at least sometimes).  We can call this “just seeing” intuition.  When [this] view of knowledge and understanding is applied to the Bible, it becomes the claim that we can “just see” what the text means, that intution can and should be all we need.  In other words, “no interpretation needed.”  The object, in this case the meaning of the text, presents itself clearly and directly to my reading.  To interpret would be to interject some subjective bias or prejudice (pre-judgment) into the process.  Thus the response, “Well, that might be your interpretation, but my Bible clearly says…”  In other words, “You interpret (and thereby misunderstand), but I intuit, seeing directly, clearly, and without distortion.”

 

 

 

Westphal refers to an ad for a new translation of the Bible billed as so accurate and so clear that the publishers could announce: “NO INTERPRETATION NEEDED.”  The ad promotes the “revolutionary translation that allows you to understand exactly what the original writers meant.”  (Unfortunately he doesn’t mention which Bible made this claim).

 

The “no interpretation needed” approach says that interpretation is accidental and unfortunate, that it can and should be avoided whenever possible.

 

What do you think?  Is interpretation unnecessary?

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